Diversability Amplified Podcast: Navigating Neurodiversity and Disability in the Music Industry with Arthur Gwynne, RAMPD [S2:E8]
In this episode, Tiffany Yu speaks with Arthur Gwynne, a passionate advocate for neurodiversity and accessibility in the music industry. Arthur shares his personal journey navigating disability, and discusses the challenges of balancing self-care with professional responsibilities. Arthur shares RAMPD’s mission to promote inclusion and support for disabled music professionals, along with the tools and strategies that have helped him succeed. Join us as we dive into his experiences working with artist Lachi, the growth of RAMPD, and the evolving conversation around accessibility and identity in professional spaces.
Arthur is featured in The Anti-Ableist Manifesto (available October 8, 2024).
About Arthur Gwynne: Arthur heads operations for the award-winning platform RAMPD (Recording Artists and Music Professionals with Disabilities) where he’s collaborated with the likes of Netflix and the Recording Academy to build inclusive programming. Arthur also manages the career of globally touring recording artist, charting songwriter and cultural activist Lachi—the go-to voice on Disability Culture in the music industry through her work on the GRAMMYs Board and as CEO of RAMPD. Throughout the course of this mission-work, Arthur stepped away from a career in executive recruitment, and opened up publicly about his own neurodiversity. Today Arthur runs a robust diverse team, booking national tours, negotiating major contracts, working everything from creative projects and music releases to development programs from cradle-to-grave. He has made it his mission to break down the silos and barriers holding back the disability community, laying seeds for a national conversation on Disability Culture and what Inclusion and Universal Accessible Design means at a practical and industrial level. Beyond all of this, Arthur is Lachi’s stylist, and designs her iconic Glam Canes.
Show Notes
Arthur's Journey and RAMPD's Success Amid Pandemic
Arthur's Neurodiverse Journey and Tools
Introducing RAMPD and Its Community-Building Efforts
Arthur's Journey to Finding His Voice
Exploring Neurodiversity and Diagnosis Journeys
Arthur's Perspective on Accessibility in Professional Spaces
Summary
Quick recap
Tiffany and Arthur discussed Arthur's personal experiences with neurodiversity and disability. They also talked about RAMPD's organization, which supports music professionals with disabilities, and the importance of accommodating individuals with disabilities in professional settings.
Summary
Arthur's Journey and RAMPD's Success Amid Pandemic
Arthur, the head of operations for RAMPD and business manager for artist Lachi, discussed his journey from executive recruitment to promoting inclusion and accessible design for the disability community. Arthur initially struggled with remote work during the pandemic but eventually found new energy and purpose in helping Lachi develop her business and getting involved in the music industry. This allowed Arthur to open up about his own neurodivergence and disabilities. Tiffany noted how the pandemic enabled Arthur and Lachi to thrive and feel more confident in their abilities.
Arthur's Neurodiverse Journey and Tools
Arthur shared his personal experience with being diagnosed with various neurodiverse conditions. They discussed their struggles with heavy medication in their youth and their current self-medication with cannabis. Arthur shared his journey of prioritizing self-care and productivity in the music industry. He highlighted the importance of finding tools that work for one's individual needs, such as using Calendly and Zoom for scheduling. Tiffany appreciated RAMPD's approach and agreed that finding the right tools is crucial for personal and professional success.
Introducing RAMPD and Its Community-Building Efforts
RAMPD is an organization dedicated to supporting music professionals with disabilities. RAMPD operates as a business with a fiscal sponsor, focusing on efficient processes, problem-solving, and maintaining partnerships. The organization's growth led to the appointment of Lachi as CEO and Arthur as operations lead, with Anya Chernoff handling other aspects. RAMPD's mission is to promote inclusion and disability identity in the music industry, with a unique community aspect where members verify and oversee the organization. Tiffany from Diversibility expressed appreciation for RAMPD's community-building efforts and inquired about Arthur's support for Lachi's career.
Arthur's Journey to Finding His Voice
Tiffany asked Arthur about how he found his own voice while supporting Lachi, who has a distinct voice. Arthur explained that he was encouraged by Lachi to be more vocal and that he developed his own voice through his conversations with people, realizing that he was helping them through their disclosure journeys and providing a sense of community. He also mentioned his role in activating the community within themselves for regional meetings and other ways to get them all connecting with each other.
Exploring Neurodiversity and Diagnosis Journeys
Arthur discussed his journey of exploring his own neurodiversity and the experiences of others. Arthur also shared his newfound sense of empowerment and the importance of documenting his journey. Tiffany affirmed that self-diagnosis is a valid form of diagnosis. Both agreed on the need to talk more about the harder aspects of neurodiversity and mental health, and the responsibility that comes with it.
Arthur's Perspective on Accessibility in Professional Settings
Arthur discussed the importance of accommodating individuals with disabilities or neurodiversities in professional settings. Arthur also shared his personal experiences and strategies for managing his own needs, such as using access check-ins and audio descriptions. Tiffany agreed with Arthur's points and highlighted the importance of individuals naming their access needs. Arthur then recommended checking out their organization, RAMPD.org, and Lachi's music and glam canes.'
Transcript
12:07:01 Hi! You've got Tiffany! You here! My pronouns are she her.
12:07:04 And you are tuning into this episode of diversity, amplified.
12:07:08 Where we are chatting with our community members a little, to learn a little bit more about their advocacy and their journey to becoming proud to be disabled.
12:07:17 So this is a special like Mini series I'm creating in the lead up to the launch of the anti-aplis manifesto. I am showing. If you are watching the video version. An advanced reader review copy of my book that has this bright orange gradient background. And Arthur is actually in the book book. So our guest today is Arthur Gwynn.
12:07:37 He heads up!
12:07:39 Operations for the award-winning platform ramped, and music professionals with disabilities.
12:07:46 Where he has collaborated with the likes of Netflix and the recording to build inclusive programming.
12:07:51 He also manages the career of globally touring artists.
12:07:56 Charting songwriter and cultural activist.
12:07:59 Who is the go to voice on disability, culture in the music industry through her work on the Grammys board, and as the CEO of Ramps.
12:08:06 And throughout the course of this mission work Arthur stepped away from a career in executive and opened up publicly about his own neurodiversity.
12:08:15 Today Arthur runs a robust team booking national tours, negotiating major contracts, working from creative projects and music releases to development programs from cradle to grave.
12:08:26 He has made it his mission to break down the silos and barriers, holding back the disability, laying seeds for a national conversation on disability, culture, and what inclusion and universal accessible design means at a practical and industrial level.
12:08:41 Beyond all of this Arthur is latte, and designs her iconic glam canes.
12:08:48 This is actually, that was actually my 1st time reading Arthur's Bio out loud.
12:08:52 But, Arthur, do you want to say Hi! And provide a visual description for our listeners and viewers?
12:09:00 Yes, and actually, my camera just went out for some freaking reason. So while I poke with that, yeah, Hi, my name.
12:09:05 I think your camera heard me.
12:09:07 Yeah, right.
12:09:08 But yeah, my name is Arthur. I'm a big and tall white guy with way, too much red hair. And I I identify as neuro divergent.
12:09:15 And yeah, no, it's absolute pleasure to be here we are.
12:09:19 Great to be with you. Yeah, I do. Operations for ramped. And I've been lots manager for a few years now.
12:09:27 And just excited to be talking with you again.
12:09:30 Yeah, I'm I'm super excited. Well, so I actually think it'd be interesting. I know a little bit of the story, but I'd love to know, like many of us within the within the disability community know we may not know you cause you said you're more the background, Ops Guy. But now you're getting your your.
12:09:47 Your opportunity to have some time on the mic. But how did you originally get connected to? What made you want to step away from executive recruitment to more of this space around really changing disability, culture and and uplifting disability, culture.
12:10:03 Yeah. So pre, Covid, I was working for the Aesc, which is the Association of Executive Search.
12:10:13 And I was kind of doing like the e-commerce side on a platform that helps executives further their careers. So they get like career training. They get.
12:10:23 Connected with search consultants and resume review and all that kind of stuff.
12:10:30 And yeah, I like my job. It was interesting. I was, you know, learning that the sea level. It's the exact same people as someone that buys batteries at, you know Walmart, like.
12:10:43 Everyone's the same, no matter how high up a hierarchy you go. You have the same kind of people complaining about the same kind of things.
12:10:50 And so it was interesting, seeing.
12:10:54 The world through that perspective.
12:10:56 And kinda like being on the other side of like that veil of how we see corporate roles.
12:11:05 But.
12:11:06 The search industry itself wasn't exactly progressive, right? Like the big idea. The whole time I was there is like, Hey, maybe we should slowly be introducing the idea of women being on.
12:11:17 In leadership positions every once in a while, you know. Let's set a 20 year goal.
12:11:22 There, you know, just really slow moving things. Not a lot of progressive conversations happening.
12:11:30 And when Covid hit especially, I was just kind of like.
12:11:34 What am I doing? You know what I mean. I'm not doing.
12:11:37 Oh, my goodness gracious.
12:11:39 Well.
12:11:40 Sorry about that. I don't know what's up my camera.
12:11:42 You know you are representing ramped. And so there's a very artistic thing happening on the screen.
12:11:48 But but when we 1st recording you did ask you said, Hey, is the video being recorded? And maybe maybe that was just.
12:11:54 The time for the video to say, it's my turn to have my own show.
12:11:59 Yeah, let's I'm gonna give it one more. But if this doesn't, if it blinks out like that again, I'll just keep it off but anyway, sorry.
12:12:07 So I had really kind of been itching to do something more impactful, right? And I didn't really know what that meant. I started getting a little bit more into like local politics, and.
12:12:18 Join my Community Board and.
12:12:21 But it it didn't really feel like it was doing all that much. But I also didn't have a lot of time for it right? Because I had a full time job and everything.
12:12:29 When Covid hit.
12:12:31 And we all started working from home. I was like the corporate culture guy. You know what I mean, like.
12:12:37 I've enjoyed.
12:12:38 Being in a corporate environment. It puts you in a nice little box where I can.
12:12:44 Be in a nice little box, and I don't have to figure out.
12:12:50 Complexities of social interactions outside of how I'm supposed to interact with coworkers. You know what I mean. And so like, it was a really easy way for me to.
12:12:59 Socialize Without.
12:13:03 Dealing with some of the.
12:13:04 Harder things for doing that more casually for me.
12:13:07 And so I was still resistant to like the idea of working from home. You know what I mean. I had never allotted with my employees every time I was in charge.
12:13:17 I always wanted to keep that office culture going. So when we were forced to work from home.
12:13:20 You know, it took me like 2 months to acclimate. But as soon as I did I started realizing just how much energy I suddenly had.
12:13:28 And I hadn't realized how much of myself was being.
12:13:32 Just on my commute to work.
12:13:34 Just from.
12:13:36 Having those office interactions that I, we're still challenging for me like someone coming up at my cubicle while I'm working or.
12:13:43 Like when we do like an office party or something, or you know the.
12:13:48 The mundane activities, or whatever, and.
12:13:52 I.
12:13:53 I found I finally had energy to start doing that thing I wanted to do to do that impact. So I started kind of looking around.
12:14:02 And at the same time.
12:14:07 For her. She's a musician. Up to that point. In the dance world. She hadn't been talking about her disabilities or anything.
12:14:16 But her manager had passed away early on, and so she had to like.
12:14:21 Reconfigure what was hers.
12:14:24 Strategy going forward, and she wanted to start incorporating her disability.
12:14:28 I've been having low vision.
12:14:31 And and so she was looking for someone to help her develop a business. And I was looking for someone doing something cool.
12:14:37 That I could help develop a business. And so it was like,
12:14:41 It was a real kind of Kismet situation at 1st it was just something I'm doing on the side, you know. We're just kinda like tossing things back and forth, and she's talking about the stuff that she wants to do.
12:14:53 And I just got more and more into it.
12:14:58 Eventually, you know, we started.
12:15:00 We.
12:15:00 Like. She had another manager in the Uk.
12:15:05 And
12:15:08 They!
12:15:09 We're kind of doing the music management stuff, and I was backseat driving.
12:15:13 And then I just kind of was like, wait, I can do this. You know what I mean. It wasn't like it was this business stuff. I'd always thought the music industry was.
12:15:22 Rough and tumble, you know, meeting in bars.
12:15:25 You know, deals on napkins kind of stuff, but like no, there was a whole lot of like just regular.
12:15:32 Commercial industry happening with like Zoom Meetings and contracts, and all the stuff that I understood.
12:15:37 And so one thing kind of led to the other. But I kind of took over and really got in into it.
12:15:45 I started traveling with lots of companion.
12:15:49 And around that time.
12:15:53 You know.
12:15:55 I had found that I was spending a lot more time doing stuff than I was doing.
12:16:00 My other work. Now don't get me wrong. I'm doing my job. I'm and I'm good at my job. But like I'm traveling a lot. I'm not telling them that, like I'm do working out of hotel rooms and stuff, but it's all remote. So it's none of your business, anyway, like whatever.
12:16:13 But it came ahead. 3 years ago we were at the Grammys cause lots of doing the work with the Grammys, which you know with ramped and everything.
12:16:23 And
12:16:25 My boss had called us all in.
12:16:28 To do our 1st in-person meeting in 2 years right? And so I was like I was already in la for it. I'm sorry in Las Vegas.
12:16:37 And I was like, Oh, I can't! I'm sick, whatever. I couldn't make it in, you know. I just copped out, and then we went to the Grammys.
12:16:42 The next day my boss calls me, and she's like, Where are you.
12:16:46 And there's this article going around of ramped up the Grammys, and my dumb ass is sitting there all proud. Next to them.
12:16:53 And sorry my secret life had been outed and I was kind of given a choice of like. Well, I can keep my job, or keep doing whatever that is, and.
12:17:03 Decided to keep doing whatever that is, and that's what I'm doing now. And I it's been
12:17:08 It took about a year of that for me to start.
12:17:11 Being more public about my own neurodiversity and talking about it, I mean.
12:17:15 My whole life had been about.
12:17:20 Adapting right and fitting in and.
12:17:23 Being normal, or whatever.
12:17:26 And
12:17:28 When I really started getting comfortable, more because of just talking to all the cool people that we were collecting around ourselves.
12:17:37 I started kind of saying it, and people are like, well, Duh, you know what I mean. I started. I stopped masking whatever that meant, and it's like my behavior didn't really change. It was just all the internal mechanisms, you know, all the stuff I was doing just to myself, and it's
12:17:52 And now I kinda get to encourage other people on that kind of disclosure or identity journeys as they're joining, ramped or just having discussions with people.
12:18:01 And it's just been really cool.
12:18:04 Yeah, thanks for sharing that. I.
12:18:06 I think you and Lach went to college together right.
12:18:09 Oh, yeah, yeah, no. I mean, yeah, no. We know each other for forever.
12:18:13 I feel like that's an important part of the story where it's like you've known each other for forever.
12:18:19 And.
12:18:20 It just so happens that during the pandemic both of you were in this transition time period.
12:18:25 And reconnect, or I don't know if you've stayed connected through this whole time.
12:18:29 But.
12:18:31 I wanted to kind of segue off of.
12:18:35 Just. It seems like the pandemic became a really transformative time for both of you.
12:18:40 So I wanted to share the quote that you shared with me that is included in the.
12:18:45 And then ask you a question about it. But but essentially it says.
12:18:49 When Covid hit Logi was in a uniquely prepared position.
12:18:53 Artists were scrambling as studio shutdown, but with a studio setup at home that fit her needs.
12:18:58 Loti was writing and producing twice as fast and with far more confidence than she had been when she was renting studios.
12:19:05 I also found myself during the shutdown.
12:19:08 With the office moving to remote work.
12:19:10 No commute, no joining small talk, I found myself with boundless energy.
12:19:14 And with an improved mood and a self built home office of my own. My productivity skyrocketed.
12:19:21 Lachi's growing success manifested into self-confidence.
12:19:25 An acceptance of her disabilities and.
12:19:27 She began speaking up about it, and the lack of representation in the music industry.
12:19:32 My difference in lived experience are an asset, and when I'm accommodated right, I'm an expletive wizard.
12:19:38 This is just one of the many examples of how prioritizing accessibility and honoring accommodations really allow people in all walks of life and stages in their careers.
12:19:48 To flourish, and truly contribute to the betterment of our world in the way only they.
12:19:52 On in the in the way only they and the mind and the body with which they came can.
12:19:57 A life of navigating a world that was not built for us made us both creative and driven.
12:20:02 Powerful traits we were able to explore. Once our access needs were met.
12:20:06 So you kind of shared like. Originally you were all about this office culture. With this introduction of remote work again. You realized you had so much more energy, and then started sharing more about your own story.
12:20:19 And I guess I'm curious if you felt like there was.
12:20:28 Hmm.
12:20:23 A turning point, or some moment. I call this the shame to pride, transformation.
12:20:30 Originally you felt like you were masking.
12:20:32 Your words to then starting to open up more about it, because you realize that when your access needs were met.
12:20:39 You could really thrive and flourish.
12:20:42 Yeah, you know, honestly, this is actually still something. I'm currently
12:20:51 So.
12:20:53 When I say neuros, right? I'm even using that term to be relatively ambiguous. But I've been trying to understand what it really means.
12:21:02 As a child and adolescent. I was diagnosed with several things like bipolar depression.
12:21:11 Adhd and a few others. I was heavily through most of my.
12:21:17 You know, young adult life.
12:21:19 And I hated everything about that.
12:21:22 And so I spent a lot of time.
12:21:26 Making sure that I didn't stand out so that I wouldn't get hammered back into place again.
12:21:32 And so that's why corporate life was great, because it wasn't that.
12:21:37 I was being shoved into a corporate box.
12:21:40 It's that I knew where all the walls were. They're written in a freaking book like, there's an Hr. Policy like there's rules. There's structure. There's things that I can just follow and obey, and then I'm.
12:21:52 I can succeed, I can thrive, I can be put to use. You know what I mean. I can have a productive.
12:21:59 Life.
12:22:01 Where I'm not being exposed to whatever.
12:22:05 Was triggering me, or causing episodes.
12:22:08 While also not having to medicate beyond.
12:22:12 I'm openly very. Pothead, so like I smoke a lot. That's my medication. Now.
12:22:18 But you know, I'm not on any like
12:22:21 A, a.
12:22:22 Medication Anymore.
12:22:25 Oh, God damn it! The fucking, anyway! That's it for the camera
12:22:31 It's only while I'm talking right like I said, here.
12:22:32 We. We know we know what you. We do know what you look like, and you provided a visual description.
12:22:37 Okay. Hurry.
12:22:38 I apologize about that.
12:22:42 But so over these past couple of years, as I've been openly identifying, right? I haven't had an adult.
12:22:51 I've had things I suspected I I do, and still suspect I might be on the spectrum.
12:22:58 You know, around Asperger's or something, but I don't have any diagnosis in that.
12:23:01 But the ones I really wanted to figure out was what had been identified as bipolar. Like, am I bipolar? Not.
12:23:08 And I'm not. I don't have. I'm bipolar but I have something called ied, which is intermittent explosive disorder.
12:23:18 And so it functionally, like.
12:23:21 Culturally, it's fairly similar to bipolar, and that's why it's often confused. But there's not a chemical aspect to it. It's really more.
12:23:31 Behavioral.
12:23:33 And on the one hand, it's like, well, that's good cause. That diagnosis doesn't include medication or anything. But, on the other hand, what's bad is that it's really just about self modulation.
12:23:42 And it's like the biggest thing. If you look it up as soon as you Google, it's like, what do you do about? It's like well, have good, regular sleep, healthy diet, and exercise. 3 things I do not do at all.
12:23:53 And I was like, well, fuck, you know, like.
12:23:57 And so and so it's been about like 2 months now, where I've really kind of been trying to understand this, and.
12:24:04 Trying to integrate it.
12:24:07 Because I preach about self accommodation right? Especially in this industry. The music industry is not.
12:24:14 For.
12:24:15 It's not healthy for anybody.
12:24:17 And it's not healthy for normative folks. It's not healthy for non disabled folks. It's healthy for anybody.
12:24:24 But figuring out how to.
12:24:28 Not just get by, but to thrive with the way that I need to live, and what makes me productive.
12:24:35 I've already been coaching folks on that for a while now through ramp, and so I started applying it to myself.
12:24:41 And so things like, you know, no more red eye flights. I don't care what the situation is, or how important it is, or how much more expensive it is. I'm not taking a red eye.
12:24:50 Because it will ruin my next day, and I can't. I'm not useful to myself. I'm not useful to. I'm not useful to anybody. If that happens.
12:24:58 I don't really drink anymore, you know, even though I'm surrounded by alcohol and.
12:25:03 It does expose me to like the sober movement and the music industry, and how important that is!
12:25:11 And I like it's.
12:25:13 Allowed me to construct.
12:25:16 My.
12:25:17 Work.
12:25:20 Structure.
12:25:21 In a way that is uniquely productive for myself, so that I can be fully activated the whole time.
12:25:29 And it's you know, I mean, I've just did a panel a few weeks ago with music managers, Forum with some ramped folks and some others, and we were talking about accommodations for Adhd in a similar way. Cause I I do have Adhd as well, and.
12:25:45 The thing that I had to do was my calendaring right? So I'm very.
12:25:51 Stringent with my calendar I use calendly. I use zoom. I use all these things to schedule my day. I've got my.
12:25:58 You know robot house robot yells my calendar at me every 10 min. You know what I mean, and but that's what allows me to do what I need to do, and because it's a tool that I can hone and craft and skills that I can hone and craft, I end up, actually being really good at it.
12:26:14 Better than someone that doesn't have to spend that much energy to kind of be at the competitive angle.
12:26:19 And so I get to really lean in on my weaknesses until they're my strengths. And I get to develop.
12:26:26 A unique structure that benefits just me.
12:26:31 Instead of the other way around, of trying to make myself benefit the structure that I'm in.
12:26:37 I love that a lot to unpack there. I think I think my takeaway is that.
12:26:43 Really finding the tools.
12:26:46 Work for you.
12:26:47 Is.
12:26:49 It's just part it, you know you I call it like a medication cocktail. You know that that those were, and those are also tools that was not working right. And so then you found these other things like.
12:27:00 Your calendar, and I also live on my calendar, too. Sometimes.
12:27:06 Text me and ask me to catch up. I send them a link to my calendar, and they said, They'll say, Oh, I just want to call you.
12:27:11 Out of the blue, and I'm like no one other than my mother. I think no one calls me out of out of the blue, because.
12:27:17 I was actually just gonna say, I gave my mom my calendar link because I was like, listen, I'm not gonna call you. So just please put a time in every couple months, and let's chat, you know.
12:27:27 I love that well, one thing you said, you said, the music industry is not healthy for anybody.
12:27:33 So I wanna talk a little bit about ramps again. Ramped is the recording artists and music professionals with disabilities.
12:27:39 Kind of some of the things you're working on there, you know. I I'm not sure if our listeners know, like what Ops people do.
12:27:45 You know. I think people will look at me, Tiffany, they'll look at. They'll just think our lives are all great, but there's so many people in the background who are keeping all the things running. So so yeah, I'd love to learn a little bit more about your involvement with ramps. Some of the big wins you've had, and and your role specifically, there.
12:28:03 Yeah, a hundred percent. So
12:28:08 Ramped is a.
12:28:10 You know, it's structured as a business, right? So now we have a fiscal sponsor.
12:28:15 That allows us to accept donations and work with grants. But we do operate as a for profit. Business.
12:28:22 You know.
12:28:23 Nominally, as like God, this camera, it waits until I start talking. I'm gonna I'm sorry I wanted to keep trying
12:28:32 The
12:28:33 And I always completely throws me off to what was saying.
12:28:38 I was. I was asking about ramps, your role specifically on the OP. Side, and what some of the wins have been.
12:28:43 Sure.
12:28:44 And you were talking about how it operates as a business.
12:28:46 Yeah, yeah. So our price of business. So like, there's definitely a business side to it, and that we structured it like a business. So when I say operations.
12:28:55 I. I like operations, because even in like a corporate environment, it's kind of like it still translates as wizard. So like I get to just be like, where's the problem? And I'll fix it. It's like I may not be the best one to fix it. I may not be the best one to do a role.
12:29:10 But I'm gonna make sure that all the things that need to be done are getting done. And then I make sure that we're hiring the people that can do it better, that we're setting up the processes that allow it to be done better. That our biggest problems are resolved and, like our biggest wins are.
12:29:27 You know, hunted on so.
12:29:30 And a.
12:29:31 And a.
12:29:32 Matured business operations will really kind of be like keeping connected with, like your partners and your vendors. Monitoring budgets, technology updates and product releases, you know, kinda just making sure all the different pieces of a machine are talking to each other and collaborating.
12:29:54 Not so much a conductor, but more like an engineer and a tower, making sure all the the.
12:29:59 Gears are greased right.
12:30:01 But and something like Rand, where we're really just kind of like.
12:30:04 And we're not even really a startup. The business was started just so that we've had a business entity.
12:30:12 To do things as and so.
12:30:16 Really in the beginning it was just like an Llc. So that we could.
12:30:20 You know, participate in certain things.
12:30:22 But we built it out pretty quick, so lots of now formally.
12:30:27 And then we've got myself doing operations. Anya, sure enough, does our
12:30:33 Program management. And we have Sal Lopez, who does our content management.
12:30:38 And what I really kind of do is just make sure all those folks have the resources they need.
12:30:45 I connect with all the members stuff which I'll talk about in a second.
12:30:48 And then I'm I try to build the relationships that lead into our next partnerships or opportunities. And as we staff up or expand our programming. Then I'm really just the one to make sure that we establish what those rules are and help get them trained in those roles.
12:31:04 And you know, once we solve one big problem, then I just find the next problem to solve after we have other people doing it.
12:31:13 Now, what's really unique about rant is the member side.
12:31:18 So as an entity ramped is really just, it's a community. It's this,
12:31:24 We've got a broad community like anyone can. Come if you got a ramps, org and and register on the site. And you're in our community like you, you'll get our newsletters. You can access our like discord. And everywhere that we're chatting and stuff.
12:31:37 But we've.
12:31:38 Members who go through a verification process which is called like to be a pro member or professional member.
12:31:45 That means that they've been vetted by other members as being professionals in the industry.
12:31:52 And as identifying as disabled, or no diverse, or having a rare disease or chronic illness, or something in the in that vein.
12:32:02 To to join the the pro community, and what the pro members do.
12:32:06 Is, we have an executive committee.
12:32:10 Which.
12:32:12 Essentially functions as an oversight committee.
12:32:14 It's ensuring that what ramps and how ramped, is doing things, and who we're doing it with always aligns with the goals of our community.
12:32:23 And those goals are to promote inclusion.
12:32:27 And disability, identity and culture throughout the music, industry.
12:32:30 Right? So we don't service the disability community. We service the music industry.
12:32:36 We don't.
12:32:37 Teach, about.
12:32:38 You know how to make your place accessible.
12:32:43 We want folks talking about. Why, you would even want to do that. In the 1st place, you know what I mean. It's not about.
12:32:51 Compliance.
12:32:51 It's about.
12:32:53 Cultural.
12:32:55 Inclusion.
12:32:55 And so when I say the industry, the industry is bad for everybody like. I've been saying this fairly recently. I don't know if I should be saying it, but it's like.
12:33:04 We, we.
12:33:05 We're not here to fix the music industry. We just want the music industry to be a shitty to disabled folks as they are to everybody else, you know. And so, like, we, we're not gonna like we're working with live nation. We're working with the Grammys like they're not necessarily like the angels like perched on a shoulder right.
12:33:23 But we're we can't fix how those operate. But what we can do is make sure that as they're doing things, they are recognizing the.
12:33:32 Purchasing power of our community, the talent, the storylines.
12:33:37 The the humanity, the dignity.
12:33:41 That we all share, and all deserve to be a part of.
12:33:46 And how culture in general is continuing to move to that.
12:33:51 Holistic viewpoint right of like. Let's be inclusive, and let's see the inclusion, and it's not about keeping it in a little corner.
12:33:59 For compliance reasons. Right? This is about proper integration.
12:34:06 And.
12:34:06 It's been really kind of interesting.
12:34:10 Trying to develop.
12:34:12 What that really looks like as a service.
12:34:15 And we've had a lot of great wins with the folks that we're already working with, and I'm really excited for what's coming in the future.
12:34:22 But I think the actual, long, lasting impact that we're making is the community that's being formed with those pro members. Not only are they making the decisions for what we're doing as a.
12:34:35 Organization.
12:34:35 But more importantly, they're being encouraged to go and do what they think is important.
12:34:40 And not everyone's out here to be a disability advocate. About half of our pro members have gone through a verified process, which means that they.
12:34:50 We're trained on like our language usage, and like what ramped is about and what we're presenting so that they can attend our.
12:34:57 But the other half of the pro membership hasn't really done that because they're not really here to be part of that discussion. They just want to.
12:35:04 Live their life. They want to pursue their careers, they want to make their art, and they don't necessarily want to be defined by.
12:35:12 Disability. But they wanna find a place where they can talk about that and not be alone with the experience either.
12:35:17 And.
12:35:18 I think that's what's really great about it, because it really is turning into this.
12:35:22 You know.
12:35:23 Melting pot of ideas and motivations and strategies and career paths and genres, and everything.
12:35:31 We're seeing collaborative efforts coming out of it. We're seeing folks.
12:35:36 Like starting initiatives to kind of like prove.
12:35:41 Their interpretation of how.
12:35:44 Their bodies and minds are able to participate in the industry, and then challenging the industry directly.
12:35:50 To do the same thing. So things like Culture city and getting
12:35:57 sensory spaces and and major venues and stuff.
12:35:59 That conversation is really taking fire and growing.
12:36:03 Sober nation which is under live nation. They're really making a an actual.
12:36:09 Concerted effort for making sober, safe, integrated.
12:36:14 Places in their venues.
12:36:15 All of these conversations are, are.
12:36:21 Like.
12:36:23 It's not necessarily like, okay, you know, learn these 5 things.
12:36:28 And then you're an expert, right? It's really just more.
12:36:32 Learning how to be empathic and how to spread empathy.
12:36:37 And building a parallel power structure of folks who are already in that mindset.
12:36:43 That just.
12:36:44 Can overwhelm all the other mindsets that we find in this industry. You know what I mean. It's like.
12:36:49 There's a thousand little cracks.
12:36:51 On the door now, and they're all stemming from this idea of authenticity, and just like actually treating people like people.
12:37:00 So I I don't really know where our feature is going to take us. I think we're gonna do amazing things.
12:37:08 As an industry.
12:37:10 Provider, I think we're really going to have.
12:37:13 Like.
12:37:14 Very loud and accessible.
12:37:17 Programming.
12:37:20 That we're gonna see prop up all over the place. But ultimately I think it's already it's a community that's having the biggest impact. And as time goes on that community impact, I we can't even begin to imagine where it's actually going to lead to. So that's what I'm most excited about.
12:37:34 Yeah, I love that. And you know, at Diversity we run.
12:37:37 We run across industry community as well, and I remember in the early days people would come to us, and they say, Oh, you know, like.
12:37:45 What advocacy issues are you tackling.
12:37:47 And I said.
12:37:49 The 1st thing we need to learn is that we have power and influence together.
12:37:53 And then you determine what the things are that you want to work on. Maybe they are connected to.
12:38:00 Changing the faces of certain industries like the music industry. Or maybe you wanna be more connected to different disability advocacy issues. But there's kind of that first.st
12:38:09 Point of entry to.
12:38:12 Of having a community, so that you realize you're not alone, and I appreciate you naming that.
12:38:17 1 1 question I do have is.
12:38:20 You know you do so much working. Lati's career.
12:38:24 And we all love you. Oh, and I think I have to disclose that I'm also on the advisory.
12:38:33 Yes.
12:38:30 Council that Advisory Board of ramped as well, and have have gotten to be witness to some of the great work. That not only you've already done, but some of the.
12:38:40 Some of what's to come, which I'm super excited about. But.
12:38:44 How do you find your own voice while supporting someone else who has a very distinct voice as well.
12:38:52 Well, I think about 90% of it, at least for me, is that Lati is actively encouraging me, too. So like.
12:39:01 I am slightly being pushed out the nest, so to speak.
12:39:05 On!
12:39:08 Being more vocal.
12:39:11 But part of it, too, is I don't know. I mean, I've.
12:39:16 Like I said.
12:39:18 I. I liked corporate culture because it was a box that I could fit myself into.
12:39:22 And
12:39:23 I've never really wanted to stand out.
12:39:26 Like that. You know what I mean. Like. I was absolutely content. Not being the center of attention.
12:39:32 We're gonna try this one more time because I have a different camera. And if it does this one does it, then it's my computer and not the camera. And that's a whole other problem.
12:39:42 The
12:39:46 But.
12:39:49 I would not be doing this if I wasn't being encouraged by Lati to do so.
12:39:53 But it's also not kinda like.
12:39:56 I'm not necessarily trying to make a platform.
12:39:59 But it's more what I came to realize.
12:40:03 Is, I had been taking calls for.
12:40:06 Almost 2 years, straight.
12:40:08 Talking to people about rant, right? Whether they're prospective members, prospective partners.
12:40:13 And I just fell in love with those conversations cause like each person I got to talk to.
12:40:19 It's almost like 50 chance. I'm either helping them through the right there on a call, helping someone through like a disclosure journey.
12:40:28 Like, which is very intimate, and, like, you know, wild.
12:40:33 Or it would be someone who already knew about themselves, but didn't have that community aspect. And we're just now getting this idea like. I don't have to do this alone.
12:40:43 And it, though I just was giving that thing I was missing.
12:40:47 Before. Covid right? The the the part that I wasn't the fulfillment. I wasn't getting.
12:40:53 I was getting that every day 5 times a day, cause I was taking all these calls now, as things continue to build up with lots.
12:41:02 I have to do actual work. I can't just, you know, gab with people all day long.
12:41:08 But it.
12:41:09 Allowed me to be really connected with our members on a 1-on-one basis and know what they're doing, and just plug them all together.
12:41:16 And I love that. It's just so energizing. To be able to just be.
12:41:24 The that conductor.
12:41:26 Of just saying, like, you guys are doing the same thing just and just smoosh them together, and something will happen. I don't even keep track of it. Just do something together. You know what I mean.
12:41:34 And so I've been doing a lot more of that and figuring out how to activate the community within itself for doing like regional meetings, and like other ways to get them all connecting with each other.
12:41:43 And generating together, rather than.
12:41:45 Trying to like.
12:41:47 Be a part of all that stuff. We want everyone to be growing regardless of us being.
12:41:51 Actual humans running into place right.
12:41:58 But you know what I lost track of. What the question was. I'm sorry.
12:42:05 Oh!
12:42:02 I was just asking, you know, how do you find your own voice when you are supporting Lati, who has her own distinct voice.
12:42:08 Sure. Yeah. So that's where my voice developed. It's like as I was having these conversations, I realized that I was developing my own.
12:42:17 Kind of ideology here, right? Like I was, I'm specifically looking at it from the neurodiversity.
12:42:23 Angle and then like invisible side.
12:42:28 Energy disabilities, sensory disabilities, those kind of things. I got to talk to a lot of different folks from a very, very wide spectrum of.
12:42:38 You know conditions, or what have you.
12:42:42 And.
12:42:44 See, the.
12:42:45 Similarities and the differences right and really.
12:42:49 Find an identity that even though I didn't really.
12:42:53 Know or understand my own specific.
12:42:56 Diagnosis identity. I guess.
12:42:59 I kind of feel like those 2 words conflict. I don't know where I'm on that conversation.
12:43:03 But
12:43:05 Well, one thing we say is that a formalis is a privilege.
12:43:09 And self diagnosis of the diagnosis.
12:43:13 Sure, fair enough. I I you know it was hard.
12:43:17 To even get. It took me like 6 months of navigating the Us. Healthcare system, and I hate it, anyway.
12:43:24 Cause that's its own trump. That's why, anyway,
12:43:28 I.
12:43:29 I forgot what I was talking about again.
12:43:36 Right.
12:43:33 You were saying. You kind of wanted to come at this from the neurodiversity angle. And you were talking to all these.
12:43:37 People who had different.
12:43:40 Different divergences and.
12:43:43 And do you think that helped.
12:43:45 Helped you figure out where you wanted to be in this space.
12:43:49 Yeah, you know, I mean, even just disclosing.
12:43:53 The id diagnosis right? Like I'm trying to head on.
12:43:58 Against.
12:44:00 Shame associated with that right, and it's like I don't know how I feel about saying it publicly.
12:44:04 But I know how I felt about not saying it publicly for most of my life, and I hated that, so I might as well try this out.
12:44:11 And
12:44:13 I don't know. Like I'm in uncharted territory, which is not where I usually find myself. I usually have a very structured.
12:44:20 You know thing, and now I'm but there's no structure in my life anymore at all, except for what I decide.
12:44:26 And it turns out I kinda like that. You know what I mean. It's like, if I'm working at 10 pm. It's because I want to be, and if I cut myself off at 10 pm. It's because I need to be, you know. So it's
12:44:36 It's.
12:44:38 Empowering. But it's also like I couldn't recommend this to anyone, because it's difficult, right? Like it's
12:44:47 A.
12:44:50 It takes a lot of I don't wanna say discipline, but more.
12:44:56 At least for me. I'm the kind of person that learns best by touching the hot pan, you know, and so.
12:45:02 I. I have to continuously learn a lot of hard lessons, as I'm building something from scratch rather than accepting a preordained model.
12:45:12 But.
12:45:13 As I'm exploring that I think.
12:45:16 Documenting. That is most important, because the thing that I think we're really missing is like we're seeing portrayals of neurodiversity.
12:45:25 But we're not really.
12:45:29 Understanding the like.
12:45:34 I think.
12:45:37 I just.
12:45:37 Feel like we need to talk more about the harder side of this like there's a quote I really liked during the Kanye thing, and I thought I saw on a reddit or something, but it was like mental health. Isn't.
12:45:50 A burden. But it's a responsibility.
12:45:53 Right. And so I feel like part of my responsibility. If I'm going to be the one going around trying to help people.
12:46:02 Understand.
12:46:03 How.
12:46:05 They can combat.
12:46:07 Shame, while also holding on to.
12:46:11 Understanding that there's certain things where you're you.
12:46:14 You can't ask everyone else to just adapt to your needs, like, if you're trying to do something, especially again.
12:46:23 Ramped is for professionals, for people who are making careers. It's a place for people that are pursuing.
12:46:31 Goals like that! You know what I mean. It's not.
12:46:34 To say that what we're talking about applies to everyone who just wants access to music.
12:46:38 Like music therapy, you know, access to music. All of those kind of things. They're super important.
12:46:45 And their entire conversations that should be happening, getting the support they need.
12:46:51 But ranch is specifically for folks that are pursuing a career.
12:46:55 And.
12:46:57 There are.
12:46:58 Areas where we can.
12:47:01 Really ask or demand for accommodation.
12:47:04 But there's also that keyword in there of reasonable right, and part of that is like, I can't just ask my staff.
12:47:12 To. Oh, well, here's what to do. If Arthur starts having an emotional episode, you know what I mean, and that's.
12:47:18 That's not in anybody's purview. And if I need someone that's going to be there because something might happen that's on me to have someone there. That's part of my accommodation, and isn't just my staff being dealing with the situation. That isn't their responsibility.
12:47:32 And.
12:47:33 It's.
12:47:35 The kind of thing that I want to explore.
12:47:39 Non-privately, at least in smaller discussions, if not necessarily like, I'm not like a social media. I barely have social media. I have a tick that.
12:47:47 I sometimes post stuff, too, and then the glames has an Instagram account. That's I'm technically managing. But I'm not really.
12:47:55 There for that kind of stuff, but.
12:47:57 If I am going to be talking about these narratives, that's where I want it to be of like.
12:48:02 Trying to find that line between instead of saying, society come to me. It's more kind of like, how can I best come to society?
12:48:12 Productively.
12:48:13 And something dot dot I don't know side of. Not a fully thought out question. But it's that's what I'm trying to explore. Yeah.
12:48:19 No, yeah. I mean, I.
12:48:20 I think we're seeing from your own narrative, from.
12:48:26 Working in this corporate space that has a lot of structure that had a rule book.
12:48:30 To now, being in an unstructured space where you are figuring out the tools you need.
12:48:35 And the systems you need to work best. I love that quote you shared around. You know I'm someone I live with a mental illness. I live with Ptsd. And.
12:48:44 I got diagnosed 22 years after a traumatic incident, and.
12:48:50 One of the things I've had to learn. Yes, there's a lot of unknowns around mental illness.
12:48:56 But part of it, I think, is knowing.
12:48:59 Is me having the knowledge of knowing.
12:49:03 I don't know when slash if I'll get triggered, but when I do, here are the strategies that I've learned to navigate that situation and not put that weight on someone else, but at least communicate that. Hey? If this happens, here's the action that I'm gonna take.
12:49:19 Yeah.
12:49:20 But.
12:49:20 And you know, part of that, too, is, I mean, cause there's still a meeting in the middle, right? It's like it's not necessarily saying.
12:49:27 Here's what to do, but there is kind of like I may have to step out so just expect that right.
12:49:32 And.
12:49:34 So one of the practices that we've really integrated, and we learned it from
12:49:40 What's their name?
12:49:43 Crap! I should remember if I'm gonna plug it, but it's an access check in.
12:49:48 Where like, you know, during filming, during like the security check, we all go around. Give a brief description what you're doing on set, and if you have any access needs, and it's not saying like, here's a list of my disabilities or diagnoses. Is this kind of saying like for me. I share well, I may need to step away if I get overwhelmed. But I'm okay, and I'll take care of myself, and I'll be right back.
12:50:09 And that's all I have to say, and so that if they see me leaving, or say, I'll be back.
12:50:15 Then they're not like, where's he going? It's like, Oh, yeah, he said. He might do that. You know, we had someone on set recently, they're like, Well, I go to the bathroom a lot, and so, if you know, if I'm off at the bathroom, I'm fine, and I'll be back, and then it. Yep. She was at the bathroom most of the time, but.
12:50:28 No one was like, Where is she, or where's the bathroom key? It's like, Okay, right? She said. She needed to do that. And so.
12:50:36 Yeah.
12:50:36 How do you? How do you get to a place where you feel comfortable naming that.
12:50:42 What do you mean? I mean.
12:50:43 Like.
12:50:44 For a lot of people.
12:50:49 Hmm.
12:50:46 I think we haven't yet integrated it into our culture to really name your access needs.
12:50:51 Yeah, I've been loving it. We've translated it over to now. We do it for all of lots. We bring the production because it's not usual for a music set to do that like.
12:51:01 Security check. It's just like you're the artist, whatever. But we do it during sound check. Since we bring everyone together, it helps you specifically so that she's not saying sound guy like she'll know their name or when they're talking to her. We tell like Lot one of Lati's accommodations. It's not just that she may not see wires and stuff.
12:51:18 But when you're addressing her to say your name first, st so then she knows who's talking to her.
12:51:22 And that has made.
12:51:25 Are.
12:51:26 The music perform is so much easier for her because she can call out the name of the Soundgar. 50 people's names. I don't remember any of their fucking names. There's this, there's that's the sound guy that's the redheaded guy that seemed in charge right? But like lots of remembers all their names from that.
12:51:40 And so we are introducing it there. We're trying to introduce it in everything, just on Zoom Meetings. We're doing.
12:51:49 Self descriptions. I I like self descriptions because they connect me to the person.
12:51:54 Like jumping on a zoom with 10 people. I kinda don't even remember 8 of them right, but when we do those little descriptions it helps cement them as a person in my head. I guess.
12:52:05 And so I found it to be an accessible tool, just for myself.
12:52:08 I also these days. I watch everything with audio description, because I can never remember the names of the characters, and so but audio description. They constantly say the character names, and so that has made me.
12:52:19 And so I think so much more.
12:52:21 But anyway.
12:52:27 Yep.
12:52:23 And you get additional context in case you know, you get you get a lot more.
12:52:28 Queen's gambit. How can anyone watch Queen's gambit on Netflix without the ad? You watch it with ad. It's thrilling. You watch it without it. It's just people fucking, playing chess for an hour, anyway.
12:52:40 As we close I wanted to know if there's anything you wanna plug.
12:52:45 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, so 1st of all, please check us out at ramps. If you have anything to do with the music, industry, or anything to do with disability or neurodiversity ramp? We are here, and we are loud, and we are here doing cool stuff.
12:53:00 I check out lots if you don't know her Lati music. La CHIM USIC.
12:53:07 That's her across all socials or her website and musiccom.
12:53:13 And we also do clames which are rhineston blind canes started making those for lots of. I make them on the side as well to order so.
12:53:23 If you're blind or low vision and interested in something for your next party, come to glames.com.
12:53:29 I love it, I love it. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and I'm sure I will. I actually know I'm gonna see you in a few weeks because we have a meeting. But if not if not virtually in a few weeks, maybe in person. Soon.
12:53:44 Yeah, absolutely no love it. Thank you so much, Tiffany.